Amiga CD32/CDTV games

I see that in the last days many entries were created specifically for CD32 and CDTV versions of Amiga games. So far they were included in the normal OCS/AGA entries. And personally I would like to keep it "merged". If an Amiga game has a disk and a cd32 version (the cd32 to my knowledge was runnable on a normal Amiga with CD-drive as well), then putting both tags in the entry should be enough. If a magazine reviews both the disk and cd32 version then both reviews should be put in the same game entry. Exception might be a vastly enhanced version which would more classify as a remake. Like Defender of the Crown (which does not have the problem, because it got the - misleading - "II" in the title. I see this similar to early/mid 90s MS-DOS games which often got a disk release and a bit later a CD-ROM release, mostly unchanged, maybe with speech added. These also should not get a separate entry. The mid-90s Amiga phase is not yet in my focus, but those entries are in acute danger of being re-merged by me eventually. If CD32 should always gets its own entry, then by all means it could better be done under a separate platform name. I can't remember this topic being discussed by us editors before, so thus far this is only my personal opinion and the way it has been done so far.

That would be me! Certainly I'm open to whatever the consensus is as it's certainly a grey area. Personally, I think the ideal solution is to have them as separate platforms - they were sold as bespoke units and as you dig deeper more and more anomalies become clear. Lots of games initially had CD32 as a tag within the OCS version for example - this is not quite correct as the CD32 was built on the AGA architecture so as a bare minimum, these would have to be created as AGA entries (which I had started doing) - to teran's point above, this then starts creating other issues where for example a game like Beneath a Steel Sky (a point and click adventure) is controlled primarily by a mouse on the regular Amiga but with a joypad on CD32 so has been recoded to allow it to do so. It starts to get pretty messy, pretty quickly which is why I started splitting them out into separate entries. With regards to reviews, this could often skew the critical opinion on games too with many CD32 reviews being (rightly) criticised for being lazy ports on to the new hardware. If you combine those with the original opinion on the games themselves, this could artificially pull the opinion of the games down.

Apologies for not raising before just going ahead and doing it, I should've raised it here first.

This is correct. A CD32 port of an older Amiga OCS game should have its own AGA entry.

When keeping CD32 version as separate entries then a CD32 platform must be created. I could do that. And maybe its a good idea. The fact that the cd32 tag exists I think this was with the intent to not have a separate version or platform. So the cd32 tag was exactly for marking the AGA games that are (also) cd32 official releases. The tag would be no longer necessary when having a new platform. Then also that the C64, the Amstrad and other computers also had a console hardware version of themselves. Also done with tags inside the computer platform and without creating duplicates. They did have even less "impact" (especially in the magazine review space) than the CD32, but it is kind of similar. In the end I would keep the CD32 case "separate" if it gets its own platform and not make it the new standard. Since the day the tag system was implemented I am generally leaning to more merging of platforms than splitting (I am still looking at ZX Spectrum/Spectrum 128 which could be merged in my eyes and the 128 only games couldl be tagged). I don't know yet what Andread thinks about it.

Thanks teran01 - The more I'm thinking of this, the more I think that a separate platform for CD32 is justified and the right way to go and that it should be treated as a unique case from the likes of the C64GS and the GX4000 - using Moby Games as a yardstick, they have 170 Amiga CD32 releases listed under the platform - that's a pretty significant number of releases compared to the 30 odd for the GX4000 and the handful for the C64GS. I'd even go so far as to say that the CDTV could and should be kept within Amiga OCS given the low impact of that machine.

As an aside, I completely agree on merging the two Spectrum categories and tagging the 128k games - architecturally it's the same as the Amstrad CPC which also has games that are 128k and/or Plus range exclusive (including those GX4000 games I referenced above). With the Spectrum too you also had early 16k models so if we were splitting based on memory constraints there really should be another platform but all of that feels overkill especially when we can tag each game separately with their memory restrictions.

About the ZX Spectrum 128 I agree on merging.

About the CD32 I haven't a strong opinion, but it had it's own custom chip (Akiko) and some games used it, so I'm ok to make a new platform.

I've noticed that thare are some 128-only games, such as Dina Blaster ...
in this case the spc-128k-enhanced tag is not enough, and spc-128k-only should be used.

Also remember do not delete the 128 version, just edit the game platfom.

Thanks for your answer. My proposal would have been to create the Amiga CD32 platform from the ashes of the empty Spectrum 128 platform. A renaming. Because I know that its not possible to simply delete platforms. I also agree that 128k-only games should get a proper tag. I introduced the 128k-enhanced tag for those games that were runnable on both machines but had some extras when using a 128k machine (better music, better preload of data/levels). A 128k-only tag is simple to understand.

Steps to do:
1. Every game that currently has the Spectrum 128 platform will be edited to get the ZX Spectrum platform and will get the new tag spc-128k-only.
2. After all SPC 128 games are edited, the platform can be renamed/remodeled to Amiga CD32 (The SPC128 has not platform image which is good, because that part I wouldn't be able to edit).
3. The new CD32 titles that were entered under the Amiga AGA platform can be switched to the new CD32 platform.

We should define when a Amiga CD-ROM game gets put under which platforms. If it was marketed an packaged with the typical CD32 logo it should get a Amiga CD32 entry. What if the box has a "for use with CD32 or Amiga1200/4000 with CD-ROM" sticker on it? This is the problematic case for me. I would not like to have two entries for it, but some could argue that it should get two entries because it fits both platforms perfectly. I tend to put those games under the Amiga CD32 when this is mentioned and obmit a double Amiga AGA entry then.

And as a related topic. Similar to the Amiga, the FM Towns computer had a "console version" the FM Towns Marty. These games are tagged right now (fmtownsmarty - very very incomplete). And I think this should stay so in the future. The Marty games were all runnable on the Towns computer. But the tag is good for those games that were marketed as Marty games as well. So the Amiga CD32 stays an exception.

Oveall it looks good to me.

Ok to avoid the double AGA entry too, but not really sure to put it in CD32, I could be wrong, but I consider the console just a secondary AGA system, if the game can run nicely on a A1200 I would put it there with a cd32 tag.

Thank you everyone for the clarity moving forward! Given this is my fault in terms of kicking this off, it's only fair that I put in the hard yards here! I'll start moving the ZX128 games now and update a few bits and bobs as I go!

I looked through a lot of CD32 box covers and I could find none that has also A1200/4000 on a sticker as well. So I guess that CD32 are put under CD32 platform and there will not be much confusion with computer AGA version that also came on CD. Most of the time the computer AGA versions seem to be disc versions and the CD32 was the CD-version.

@Andrea: One more thing thats quite hidden today but should be removed. The combined search "ZX Spectrum 48/128". This still exists, however hardly usable because in the platform list in the search form it only appears as "combined" togehter with other old "combined" searches. It was usable in the old UVL site search but the current it looks not good. Whatever, at least this specific combined search should be removed.

Thank you all.
I ask you not to "delete" the Spectrum 128 platform, just leave it without games, and eventually accompained by a short article about the spc-128k-only tag.
I'm still planning to introduce a proper "sub-system" hardware repository.

Ok, so no renaming to Amiga CD32? Because that was the plan to not have an empty platform.

Spectrum 128 platform is empty now. I still hesitate to click on the create new platform button for CD32.

Please create e new platform.

Amiga CD32 platform is created and can be used now.

The Amiga AGA games with the "CD32" in name title and with cd32 tag should be checked now to be changed platform to CD32. For games under the CD32 platform I guess the cd32 can be removed. What happens with the cd32 tag afterwards? Is it still needed? Reserved for AGA (computer) games that... what exactly? I mean if an AGA game has a CD32 game counterpart, then its done with version-relation already.

Thanks for setting up the new platform!



I'm in the process of going through the Amiga platforms and fleshing them out a bit so I fully expect this to evolve a little over the coming months. In the meantime, I'm going to go through the CD32 tag and ensure there's a CD32 game set-up, any that don't have them (and is an official CD32 release) I'll create them and delete the tag, because I agree it's no longer needed for the majority - I can't say for certain mind you that there aren't any of the Amiga CD releases that would happen to work for the CD32, I cannot say that categorically... if I do come across any that fit into that criteria, I think the CD32 tag can still be used (and I'll flag it in this forum thread to show where I think I've found one in case we want to debate it or not) but otherwise the tag can probably be decommissioned.